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Model, actor and animal behaviorist Isabella Rossellini has no regrets. At the golden age of 72, the child of actress Ingrid Bergman and Italian director Roberto Rossellini has learned her fair share of lessons during her five decades-long career. Now, in Edward Berger’s papal whodunnit Conclave, Rossellini transfers that resilience to Sister Agnes, a primarily silent yet intimidating nun tasked with caring for the cardinals as they meet to elect a new Pope after the former one dies under mysterious circumstances. As the candidates, marshaled by Cardinal Lawrence (Ralph Fiennes), backstab and clandestinely strategize, Sister Agnes holds crucial information.
DEADLINE: You’ve had so many varied roles in your long career. What made you want to be a part of this one?
ISABELLA ROSSELLINI: The script was a page-turner. I read it several times, especially the ending. It is a very surprising ending that I found very moving because I think the core of the film is about doubt. All of these political discussions amongst the cardinals feel very much like the political discussion we are living these days in America. But it’s also about corruption and personal ambition. You see many layers of human nature. And finally, when you think that all the doubts are resolved, they elect a pope and doubt returns. To me, Cardinal Lawrence gives a beautiful speech at the beginning of the film, talking about the evil of certitude and the moral preciousness of doubt. He says, “In doubt, there is mystery, and if they don’t have doubt in mystery, we wouldn’t need faith. So, let’s bow to what we don’t understand, what we don’t know, and accept it.” And the film ends again on that note, which I think is so powerful and moving.
DEADLINE: Even though Sister Agnes doesn’t say much, the impact of what she knows permeates the film.
ROSSELLINI: I never imagined her different from the way I played it. But then everybody’s saying, “Oh, you have such authority,” while nuns have a more submissive role. I know I played her with a lot of authority because I went to Catholic school, and my nuns had a lot of authority. I suppose I could have played her differently in a submissive way, but I played it instead with a lot of authority, and I never doubted that that was the right way to play it, and Director Berger agreed. She’s outside of the pope’s election cycle, so when she speaks, she just speaks the truth, what she’s seen, and then she goes back to silence. But I love that in the film, she’s like a shadow, and her presence throughout the film makes you ask, “Is she really just preparing the room? Is she just collecting the keys to their bedroom?” She’s listening, and that’s so powerful.
DEADLINE: Did you happen to pull inspiration from your mother’s role as Sister Mary Benedict in The Bells of St. Mary’s for inspiration in playing Sister Agnes?
ROSSELLINI: No. I didn’t even think about it. Only after the film came out and I met the press was I reminded that mama played a very powerful, modern nun who teaches a little boy how to defend himself.
DEADLINE: How did you approach preparing for a character with limited screen time as opposed to larger roles? Is there a difference for you in the process?
ROSSELLINI: No, because you’re still portraying a person, but in a way that gives you lesser chances. You have to be more precise at figuring out your character and making them identifiable and understandable, but you’re only given a few scenes to do that. I often play supportive roles, not leads, but sometimes when I had longer parts, I could say something like, “Maybe she has a sense of humor? Maybe she lies?” Sometimes, there is something surprising about a character that you can remedy later on in another scene, you can fill in what was missing. But when you have a small role, your aim should be more precise, and you should really know what to do with every second you’re on screen.
DEADLINE: Stanley Tucci said in an interview that you introduced him to a fabulous restaurant with a familial connection to you while filming this movie. Where was this?
ROSSELLINI: I took him to a restaurant run by nuns called L’Eau Vive. It’s a place where my mom used to go because she was very famous, and whenever we went to a normal restaurant people would come up and ask for an autograph or paparazzi would start bothering her. But they left her alone when she went to this nun restaurant because the nuns had hardly seen films. I remember once that one of them said to her, “I think you’re an actress,” and the nun was delighted because she wanted to know about the lifestyle, how actors lived, what they did, etc. It’s a lovely place where the nuns serve food, are very humble and sing. There are also a lot of cardinals and priests, it’s a hangout for the Vatican. It’s a delight.
DEADLINE: Conclave brings up this notion about what you’re passionate about vs. finding your own true calling. Growing up in this acting family, was there another path for you?
ROSSELLINI: I don’t know that I had a calling that was so powerful as being a nun — more than anything, I’ve liked narrating. I wish I’d been a director earlier instead of just remaining an actress. I’m a raconteur. I attribute that to the fact I belong to a generation where there weren’t too many women directors. My mom whispered to me one day that she thought she could be a director, especially when she was older and always at home, dying to have a job. I think she could have been like Laura Dern, a good friend of mine, who buys books and options stories and develops the material for herself. But that’s a change in the generation; it’s not that my mom was lesser than Laura, but it didn’t occur to her.
DEADLINE: You have your degree in animal behavior. Is zoology in your future?
ROSSELLINI: I do have a master’s degree in Ethology, which is a part of zoology, but it’s more specifically animal behavior. But that’s more like Jane Goodall, who worked with chimpanzees and was the founder of the science of animal observation in the wild and how they live. The films that I make as a director are always about animals and ethology.
DEADLINE: Sister Agnes’s use of her agency is also very important in assisting Cardinal Lawrence in the election cycle. She has that line, “I know my role is to be invisible. Nevertheless, God gave me eyes and ears. So, therefore, I see and hear.” Can you talk more about that scene?
ROSSELLINI: In hearing this, Cardinal Lawrence then denounces one of the cardinals lying to the others. And she steps in to say, “No, that’s the truth.” And nobody doubts that what she says is correct. Though she’s not part of the process, she intervenes to say the truth. She has nothing to gain and nothing to lose. All the others, sometimes they lie a little bit or portray things because it’s their ambition to become a pope, she can’t be a pope, she doesn’t have any power. Her invisibility, though, gives her a lot of power.
DEADLINE: There’s a lot of tension at first between her and Cardinal Lawrence that eventually shifts.
ROSSELLINI: I think her vow to be a nun, whether whatever pope was going to be elected, she was going to be serving. She might have an opinion, but she made the vow of understanding that human beings are faulted and limited. So whatever pope was going to be elected, whether it was a liberal or a conservative, she was going to be serving. I think she likes Cardinal Lawrence because of that speech. I was very impressed with that speech, and I thought she saw him admitting doubt, meeting the human frailty and human limitation is what she admired most.
She’s not admiring him when there is an accident and revelation with the other nun, and she wants to handle it because she’s responsible for the nuns and Cardinal Lawrence wants to interrogate her. That irritates her because that’s her domain, dealing with the nuns. He should just stay in the patriarchy; she stays here and you stay there. But when it comes to doubt and basic truth, I think she’s on the same wavelength as Cardinal Lawrence.
DEADLINE: What about your female agency? Your mother had quite a personal and professional blowback in terms of the situation with your father, which you had to sit with your whole life [Bergman had an affair with Rosselini’s father and she was conceived before their marriage]. Are there are any lessons you perhaps learned while navigating your career or seeing your mom regain her agency?
ROSSELLINI: That derailed her a lot. Look, I have an accent because of it. My mom couldn’t come back to America for 10 years. I wouldn’t have an accent if I hadn’t grown up in Europe speaking French and Italian. I would’ve come to America earlier. The first time I came to America I was 18. She continued acting after that, but it was a terrible blow. All her money was confiscated, she couldn’t see her daughter [Pia Lindström] for eight years. She was condemned by the American Senate, who took a stand against her. It was very severe. She continued to work, but not in Hollywood anymore. She worked in European films and did theater. It was a big blow to her career and as a person.
As for me, I do what I like and what interests me. Curiosity is my engine. I look at things that I’m curious about and I always find that if I follow my curiosity, I find happiness and joy, and if I try to pursue success or recognition, it just leads you to a dark place of depression. So, maybe I’ve learned from my mama or dad for sure because he was such a rigorous artist. My father was a very influential filmmaker more than a box office success just because he followed what was interesting to him. And my mom had that, too, for sure. She had, maybe more than any other Hollywood actress, maybe also due to the scandal, an incredible career that spanned Europe. She worked with people from Hitchcock to Ingmar Bergman, my father to Victor Fleming. She did theater, television, all of it. So, I think she was also pursuing her passion and interests and was less concerned about [the overall trajectory of] her career. The concept of, “It will be good for my career…” I never really heard that talk in my family.
